How stupid is America? Trump says get rid of Daylight Savings Time (trending) and people have it ass backwards

[underpants]

Link to tweet

?s=46&t=3VBm1LJ8j8qLp6JTs_8J2A

Daylight saving time (DST), also referred to as daylight saving(s), daylight savings time, daylight time (United States and Canada), or summer time (United Kingdom, European Union, and others), is the practice of advancing clocks to make better use of the longer daylight available during summer so that darkness falls at a later clock time. The typical implementation of DST is to set clocks forward by one hour in spring or late winter, and to set clocks back by one hour to standard time in the autumn (or fall in North American English, hence the mnemonic: "spring forward and fall back&quot .


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daylight_saving_time

[boston bean]

1. Trump fucked up as per usual.

[vapor2]

5. What could go wrong?

[DenaliDemocrat]

41. I actually agree with this

I hate daylight savings time.

[Initech]

46. Of course he did!

When have these fuckheads ever been known to do the right thing?

[RandomNumbers]

2. Considering the outcome of the election ...

do you REALLY have to ask the question in your subject line?

Oh okay I get that it is a RHETORICAL question. My bad.

Yes, very, VERY stupid.

Especially about daylight savings time. Hence why we still have it, years (decades?) after most intelligent people have realized the stupidity of it.

[returnee]

3. I couldn't care less which one we keep.

I just hate the change. Employers/businesses could simply be more flexible about work hours when possible.

[Jerry2144]

9. The further north you go,

The bigger the difference between summer and winter length of day. I am partial to setting the half hour as the permanent solution, midway between standard and delight time.

If we stay in daylight, winter sunrise would be 8 here in Las Vegas. If we stay on standard, then summer sunrise would be 4:30. Neither are great. But the half hour puts sunrise at 7:30 and 5 which are better.

It’sa shame the earth isn’t flat.

[muriel_volestrangler]

21. Would you then divide the USA into hour-wide zones, a whole number of hours from GMT, but centred

half an hour wrong; or use the existing zones (which aren't perfect, but sort of close) and set them something-and-a-half hours from GMT?

[Jerry2144]

25. Keep same time zones but offset by half an hour

Like they do in some regions in Asia

[Retrograde]

28. Keep it simple

My relatives in EST have a hard enough time dealing with whole hour time differences, as do many others.

Anyway, IMHO it's not the time zones that are the problem, it's the twice a year arbitrary changes in clock settings.

[Jerry2144]

34. Exactly.

That’s why stopping the twice per year time change and going to the half hour wobble with for much of the US There are regions and areas that it would be less than ideal. But I think a remap of the time zone makes sense

[muriel_volestrangler]

40. I think that if the country wants to stop the twice yearly change, states should be able to decide what they want

rather than saying they must stay in the same groupings as at present. Using a half hour offset may not be complicated internally, but for those on the borders with Canada and Mexico it means an odd adjustment.

[carpetbagger]

48. The bane of a Newfoundlander's existence.

My girlfriend's from there. Her family lives in Alberta now, near an Atlantic Canada restaurant/store with a clock that says "It's 5:30 somewhere".

Vegas is rough, because like AZ, you really want the sun to go down quickly in the summer.

[Blues Heron]

4. Going off our current system would be highly stupid -it's there for a reason.

You don’t bust your ass getting out the door a hour before dawn in winter for a reason - it sucks! On the other hand, why not get going early in summer, then reap the benefits in the long evening? Ther is only one way to avoid the first and indulge the latter- changing the clocks. But apparently that is a bridge too far for some people

[Phoenix61]

6. I love DTS. I'm 30 miles west of the Eastern Time Zone.

Sunset here is at 4:30. A mere 30 miles away it’s at 5:30. In my perfect world they’d shift the line an I be in EST.

[D. Spaulding]

7. It's not really about more daylight

It's weather you have that daylight earlier in the morning, or later in the evening.

[marybourg]

13. Exactly!

[lame54]

8. He wants us to live in darkness

[J_William_Ryan]

10. "How stupid is America?"

Cleary this is rhetorical.

[Wiz Imp]

11. Americans strongly support permanent daylight savings time over permanent standard time

though health experts argue for permanent standard time.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/more-americans-prefer-daylight-savings-to-standard-time-cbs-news-poll/

More Americans prefer daylight saving time to standard time - CBS News poll

Also:

A May 2024 YouGov poll found 58% of Democrats and 63% of Republicans support making daylight saving time permanent. Of those who supported locking the clocks in a 2022 Monmouth University poll, 44% preferred permanent daylight saving time (the time we observe from March to November).

https://www.livescience.com/health/sleep/the-case-against-daylight-saving-from-a-neurologist-and-sleep-expert

The case against daylight saving, from a neurologist and sleep expert

https://www.bmj.com/content/387/bmj.q2335.full

Daylight saving time harms health and increases inequalities
...................................

However, Trump's claim that DST is "Very costly to our nation" has absolutely no evidence to support it that I can find. In fact, DST was first implemented to save energy costs which I'm sure it still does.

Oh Trump also calls DST inconvenient. The only thing inconvenient about it is switching back and forth. I don't see how full time DST would be any more inconvenient than full time standard time.

[QED]

12. I don't care one way or the other but think everyone everyone changes or no one does

It's damn annoying to figure out time zones when everyone else changes while we here in AZ don't. Times change on TV programs - well, some do and some don't.

Actually, part of our state does observe DST.

[ratchiweenie]

14. The Southern (Republican states) are just as dark but are warm. It makes a huge difference when it's dark and freezing

cold.

[tanyev]

15. Yep. Everyone I know that whines about it hates that it gets dark late afternoon/early evening.

I get it, but the only other option is having it stay dark a lot longer in the mornings. The only way to escape so many hours of darkness in the winter months is to move much closer to the equator.

Because science.

[RandomNumbers]

17. Well yeah, but science.

Numerous studies have shown that permanent standard time would be better than permanent daylight savings time.

But also that changing the clocks is the worst approach of all.

Well for human health and all that. Someone upthread seems to think that's not important.

Given modern technology, I don't understand why we can't adjust the schedules of things to align with the hours we want to be awake, rather than forcing a clock change on everybody.

For people who really want more daylight all the time, as you say, they have to move closer to the equator. It's not fu*king rocket science. Science, yes, but not that hard to figure out.

[asm128]

20. This

What he said!

[republianmushroom]

16. How stupid is America? Very, they did vote the convicted felon in as President.

Now stupid was that ?

[Initech]

18. We're now in the vicinity of Moron Zone, formerly known as the United States of America...

[zorbasd]

24. Great scientific minds once immigrated to the US

for its great universities in science and engineering. Now, they laugh at our stupidity. China and Europe will keep killing us in advancedments academically.

[GreenWave]

19. Wake up Dirty Don, this saving time scam was created by golfers, NOT farmers.

[Scrivener7]

22. He has no intention of doing this.

[Strelnikov_]

23. Kids going to school in the dark

Yea, that’s good.

[Quixote1818]

35. Or just open the schools an hour later. They already start at 9am in a lot of cities. nt

[Historic NY]

26. They want to keep us in the dark

[Johonny]

27. To be fair, he is so high on uppers he is awake all

Day and night and so it makes no difference to him.

[Tickle]

39. He's too fat to be on uppers,

then again it doesn't make him any less of an asshole. He also shoves Twinkies down his throat and soda before and after he makes a McDonald's run.
I do agree with you that he's always awake but I think it's more of a sugar high.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

29. Let it Be.

Let him try to get rid of DST.

Maybe some will notice how ass-backward he got it.

[bmichaelh]

30. MAGA do not critically think

Some of MAGA voters do not know how to critically think.

They believe as factual everything that appears on Facebook on their phones.

I know this from family members.

They do not go to google news or other methods to see if there is more than one source for the article they read on Facebook.

[RubyRose]

31. I don't care which one they standardize on, just stop

Changing the time twice a year.

[regnaD kciN]

32. This is a minor issue, but important for me...

If we had to settle on one time, I would prefer permanent DST.

The reason for this is that I'm a landscape photographer in the PNW. In summer, I do a lot of sunset shots, and having them an hour later makes it easier for me to get to them. If we just go back to standard time, it pretty much guarantees that I'll wind up getting stuck in rush-hour traffic (which is awful in the Seattle area), meaning I'd have to leave a lot earlier and spend much more time on the road. It also means I'll have to get up an hour earlier for sunrise shoots, which generally see me up before 3:00 A.M. even now. Moving that an hour earlier is going to make it even worse, and means I'll be driving while more fatigued.

Sure, it's a drop in the bucket compared to mass deportations, persecution of trans people, or the military charged with eliminating the "enemy within," but it's a definite issue for me.

[Blue_Tires]

33. He has zero fuckin' intention or ability to follow through on this

By Monday morning Donnie will forget he ever said it, and nobody will bring it up ever again.

But his real intention (getting us to talk about him and very likely distracting our attention from something a lot more newsworthy going on) was once again accomplished. Everybody (myself included) needs to stop wasting time and energy over whatever half-assed hot take of the day TFG has and focus on his actions.

[Jack Valentino]

36. Use of daylight savings time saves energy, and thus helps fight against global warming---

from what I recall having read....


That's reason enough to keep it, regardless of how it may be confusing
to us mere mortals

[LeftInTX]

38. It does not. It uses it. That's why AZ does not have DST.

[Jack Valentino]

43. Sorry, but according to Google and the US Department of Energy, you are WRONG on this:

From Google:

"That extra hour reduces overall energy consumption by reducing peak energy consumption hours. In other words, if the sun is out, no need to turn on the lights. How much energy do we save? Nearly 1.3 TeraWatt-hours per year in the U.S., according to a 2008 Department of Energy report."

https://www.google.com/search?q=does+daylight+saving+time+save+energy+or+cost+more+energy&sca_esv=0f3e066a9dd8d890&sxsrf=ADLYWILaJPL17mrvAAyswIG20nEpx95-oA%3A1734408797090&source=hp&ei=XfpgZ_zjAvSbwbkP4rXa6Ac&iflsig=AL9hbdgAAAAAZ2EIbZdq5VJhbMi-tCzsd0bhP1Jv90TR&oq=does+daylight+&gs_lp=Egdnd3Mtd2l6Ig5kb2VzIGRheWxpZ2h0ICoCCAAyBBAjGCcyBRAAGIAEMgUQABiABDIFEAAYgAQyBRAAGIAEMgUQABiABDIFEAAYgAQyBRAAGIAEMgUQABiABDIFEAAYgARI51FQ5RJYyidwAXgAkAEDmAGqF6AB9meqAQs0LTEuMi4xLjktNLgBAcgBAPgBAZgCBqAC5zeoAgrCAgcQIxgnGOoCwgILEC4YgAQYsQMYgwHCAggQABiABBixA8ICDhAAGIAEGLEDGIMBGIoFmAOcAfEF9QblTKnMXC2SBw0wLjEuNC0xLjIuOC0yoAelSA&sclient=gws-wiz


The very reason for being of DST was to save energy nationally--- first created during World War One, and re-initiated during World War Two, to save energy for the war effort--- lots of historical info in this link, kudos for forcing me to research it!---

https://energyharbor.com/en/energy-resources/energy-savings-tips/daylight-saving-time-save-energy#:~:text=That%20extra%20hour%20reduces%20overall,2008%20Department%20of%20Energy%20report.


As for Arizona, I have spent at least one year of my life in that state in total. Last time started at the height of summer...

While DST saves energy nationally, that might not be true in Arizona when you take air conditioning into account---
the one state where AC is most necessary out of all 50, IMHO.

However, I have some doubts that they opted out of DST for the sake of saving energy--- unless it was AC in the evening--
(since that has been their policy for 30 or 40 or more years, when Republicans controlled everything)--

having lived there for some time during the summer,
I believe and agree with them that it is just so goddamned hot there
during the summer in the area where most of the citizens live (greater Phoenix),
that they just don't WANT the sun blaring down on them
for one extra hour in the evening in the summer in particular, and it makes sense there.

It may actually SAVE them some energy there, with AC costs,
but it is much less relevant in the rest of the country.

[LeftInTX]

49. Studies have shown that AC uses much more electricity than heating. And it's true for all 50 states

And if you think this only applies to Texas, think again.

States in the north consume about 1/2 the energy that states in the south consume and it's not based on summer. It's based on year round. It isn't just Texas. It's places like Virginia.

So what were you saying about Texas??? Only Texas and AZ?? What about all those other states???

https://www.energybot.com/blog/average-energy-consumption.html

[LeftInTX]

37. He's correct! DST is outdated and actually consumes more energy.

Our nation consumes more electricity on air conditioning than we do heating. This is a change from 1975.
Therefore DST consumes more energy.

more recent studies within the United States have shown the opposite to be true. A study which examined the energy consumption levels in Indiana, has shown an increase in residential electricity consumption of 1%. Lastly, some studies suggest that while daylight saving time may increase overall consumption, it limits peak demand for electricity. In the next section, I will discuss the mechanisms by which DST is thought to save energy in some cases and waste it in others. [1]

Lighting, Heating and Cooling
Most of the electricity savings due to daylight savings are a result of what has been termed the Benjamin Franklin effect. Essentially, because in the summer people wake up after the sun has risen, but go to sleep after it has set, some daylight is wasted in the morning. By shifting wake-up times earlier, daylight can be used instead of electric lighting later in the afternoon and evening. Fig. 1 shows how DST adjusts at which hours there is sunlight to produce this effect. However, electricity usage for heating and cooling of houses has been found to increase during daylight savings time. This is hypothesized to occur because people spend more time at home at warmer hours during daylight saving time, and are more likely to crank up the AC. Conversely, an increase in warming may occur in the morning as people are awake during colder temperatures than they otherwise would be. Regardless of the exact cause, these effects often overpower the decrease in electric lighting needed. [4]

Further, evidence suggests that because of DST, people are more willing to stay out later into the day. This causes an increase in car usage, which corresponds to an increase in gasoline consumption by as much as 0.5 - 1% during DST. [2] This could mean an additional 8,000 barrels of gasoline used per day based on US consumption, which further offsets electricity savings. [5]


http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2021/ph240/segal2/

Unfortunately, he won't have the support of Florida and Texas due to the recreational and travel industries in both states. DST is good for travel. It's popular with sports etc. Bush pushed extended DST and won. It was his Texas/Florida pact that pushed it.

[Jack Valentino]

44. He is NOT correct. I take it for granted that you are a loyal Democrat, BUT--

it sometimes seems as if you are an apologist for Trumpy sides of some issues.

This is not a personal attack, just an observation, but IMHO you should take a good look at some of the things you say here...


Quite possibly the Texas climate is another where DST might not be advantageous,
but nationally overall it IS, and saves energy on a national basis.

[LeftInTX]

47. Oh, so you say I'm a Trumper???? Do you have recent studies that prove it saves energy??

Are you a scientist??? How do you know it saves all this energy??? Is it because you personally don't like me??? Is it because you think you are better than me???? Please show me these illuminating articles because it is actually the Republicans that are huge supporters of DST. DST has been proven to benefit businesses. Just because Trump is "right" about this issue doesn't mean he understands it or even know what he is talking. For all I know he probably wants permanent DST like the rest of the Florida GOP does and he's just saying he's getting rid of it, when he really just wants to get rid of changing the clocks. Rubio was the one behind the permanent DST push. You're new here I see......




Is Stanford University a Trump University?

The Diminishing Returns of Daylight Saving Time
Sam Segal
December 11, 2021
Submitted as coursework for PH240, Stanford University, Fall 2021

Lighting, Heating and Cooling
Most of the electricity savings due to daylight savings are a result of what has been termed the Benjamin Franklin effect. Essentially, because in the summer people wake up after the sun has risen, but go to sleep after it has set, some daylight is wasted in the morning. By shifting wake-up times earlier, daylight can be used instead of electric lighting later in the afternoon and evening. Fig. 1 shows how DST adjusts at which hours there is sunlight to produce this effect. However, electricity usage for heating and cooling of houses has been found to increase during daylight savings time. This is hypothesized to occur because people spend more time at home at warmer hours during daylight saving time, and are more likely to crank up the AC. Conversely, an increase in warming may occur in the morning as people are awake during colder temperatures than they otherwise would be. Regardless of the exact cause, these effects often overpower the decrease in electric lighting needed. [4]

Further, evidence suggests that because of DST, people are more willing to stay out later into the day. This causes an increase in car usage, which corresponds to an increase in gasoline consumption by as much as 0.5 - 1% during DST. [2] This could mean an additional 8,000 barrels of gasoline used per day based on US consumption, which further offsets electricity savings. [5]

The Future of Daylight Savings
While many studies show conflicting or inconclusive results regarding the ultimate effect on energy consumption from DST, it seems that future trends will make energy savings from DST less likely. In short, when the early analysis was done in the 1970s, energy consumption was much different. Remember that energy savings from DST come from a reduction in use of electric lighting. However, today's 10 Watt LED Light Bulbs can provide the same lumen output as a traditional 100 Watt Incandescent bulb, showing a 90% increase in efficiency. [6] While climate-control systems have also improved, not nearly to the same degree, only showing an increase of 30% to 50%. [7] Even more important, climate control has become much more prevalent than it was in the 1970s and is moving towards ubiquity.

Therefore, as the energy required to provide power decreases due to advancements in technology and continued adoption of LEDs and fluorescents over incandescents, and energy used by climate control systems increases both due to widespread adoption, and perhaps even climate change, we can expect further increases in energy used during Daylight Savings.

Conclusion
In conclusion, it seems that while there is still disagreement about whether or not Daylight Saving Time saves or wastes energy, trends in technology seem to show that the energy returns are and will continue to diminish. However, it should be noted that while energy saving was indeed the exigence and origin of DST, there are other harms and benefits it may confer. For example, some studies have shown that the later daylight prevents car accidents and deters crime. [5] Meanwhile, many simply prefer the "extra" daylight given by DST. Therefore, even if a consensus is reached that DST wastes energy, we may see it continue for other reasons.

.
http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2021/ph240/segal2/

Is MIT a Trump University?

In conclusion, we find that the long-standing rationale for
DST is questionable. If anything, the policy seems to have
the opposite of its intended effect. We should keep in mind,
however, that this surprising result may not have always
been the case. Air-conditioning is an important factor, and
only recently has it become so prevalent; between 1978 and
2005 electricity used for air-conditioning in U.S households
increased almost 250% (Energy Information Administration, 2008). While this particular trend is not likely to
reverse anytime soon, there are other arguments made in
favor of DST. These range from increased opportunities for
eisure, enhanced public health and safety, and economic
growth. In the end, a full evaluation of DST should account
for these multiple dimensions, but the evidence here suggests that continued reliance on Benjamin Franklin’s old
argument alone has become misleading
https://resources.environment.yale.edu/kotchen/pubs/revDSTpaper.pdf

https://direct.mit.edu/rest/article-abstract/93/4/1172/57919/Does-Daylight-Saving-Time-Save-Energy-Evidence?redirectedFrom=fulltext

Is Scientific American a Trump publication?

Does Daylight Saving Time Conserve Energy?

Recent studies shed some light on the efficiency of seasonally changing the clocks

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/does-daylight-saving-times-save-energy/



Does Daylight Savings Time Actually Save Energy?

Is McGill University in Canada a Trumpy school??

Does Daylight Savings Time Actually Save Energy?
So, who benefits from DST, if not farmers, and (potentially) not energy producers? For one, businesses. More light in the evenings means more time to shop and spend money. The Association for Convenience and Fuel Retailing, a lobbyist for convenience stores, has pushed to start daylight saving time earlier in the year. Lobbyists from the American golf industry estimated in 1986 that an extra month of daylight saving would be worth between $200 and $400 million USD.
https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/history-environment-did-you-know/does-daylight-savings-time-actually-save-energy

Does Daylight Saving Time Save Energy?
In a separate study, Kotchen worked with Laura Grant, now an assistant professor of economics at Claremont McKenna College, to research Daylight Saving Time in Indiana from 2004 to 2006. They found that the time change increased residential electricity usage as much as 1%. As in previous studies, the report found less demand for lighting at night, but electricity demand caused by heating (during cooler mornings) and cooling (during hotter evenings) more than offset those savings.
“If you extrapolate those results from Indiana and say how they would apply to the country as a whole, then it would suggest that from an energy perspective, Daylight Saving Time is not a pro-environmental policy,” Kotchen says.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-03-09/does-daylight-saving-time-result-in-lower-energy-bills?embedded-checkout=true

But look at what Rubio is saying? Are you gonna agree with Rubio??? If you do, can I call you a Trump supporter???

Rubio Reintroduces Bill to Make Daylight Saving Time Permanent
Mar 2, 2023 | Press Releases

Ahead of Daylight Saving Time, U.S. Senator Marco Rubio (R-FL) reintroduced the Sunshine Protection Act of 2023 for the 118th Congress. The legislation would end the antiquated practice of changing clocks twice a year.

https://www.rubio.senate.gov/rubio-reintroduces-bill-to-make-daylight-saving-time-permanent/

[Vinca]

42. Who cares? He's just spewing BS anyway and nothing will happen.

[H2O Man]

45. Recommended.

I hope that he concentrates on legalizing Lonnie Anderson's hair.