A Federal Judge Has Gone to Great Lengths to Make Clear Trump Really Did Rape E. Jean Carroll . MotherJone Jan 2024

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

Last edited Mon Dec 16, 2024, 06:45 PM - Edit history (1)

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/01/a-federal-judge-has-gone-to-great-lengths-to-make-clear-trump-really-did-rape-e-jean-carroll/

MOTHER JONES
January 18, 2024

A Federal Judge Has Gone to Great Lengths to Make Clear Trump Really Did Rape E. Jean Carroll

Why state-level legal minutiae impacts what words are used to describe the former president’s criminal conduct.

District Judge Lewis Kaplan has said it multiple times: Donald Trump raped E. Jean Carroll in 1996. Kaplan wrote it in May 2023, when he presided over one of the trials against Trump. And he reminded jurors of the rape this week, during the latest proceedings in the multi-layered, winding rape and defamation cases brought against Trump by Carroll.

Last spring, author and journalist Carroll sued Trump, testifying that he had raped her decades ago and had defamed her since by denying the accusations. Carroll won that suit. The jury found Trump liable for sexual assault and said he must pay $5 million—but they came short of saying he had raped her due to the legal scope of New York State’s penal code.

MORE…..

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ADDED this …….

https://newrepublic.com/post/174448/judge-e-jean-carroll-case-yes-donald-trump-rapist

July 19, 2023

Judge in E. Jean Carroll Case: Yes, Donald Trump Is a Rapist

A judge rejected Trump’s semantic attempt to throw out the case.

On Wednesday, Trump’s request for a new trial in the E. Jean Carroll case, after he was found liable for sexual abuse, battery, and defamation, was rejected. And in his desperate attempt to avoid accountability, the twice-impeached and twice-indicted former president may have unintentionally allowed himself to now be formally known as a rapist.

[hlthe2b]

1. The judge referenced his act as meeting definition of rape in most states. He was NOT convicted but adjudicated

(found liable) in a civil trial. Please fix your subject line. The judge did NOT say "convicted" nor would he.

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

3. Rape is Rape

More from New Republic article….

….. But Judge Lewis Kaplan called Trump’s semantic argument “entirely unpersuasive.” He clarified that the jury found that the former president did indeed “rape” Carroll based on the common definition of the word.

Kaplan noted that New York penal law (the jury in the Carroll case was based in New York) has a “far narrower” definition of the word “rape” than in “common modern parlance, its definition in some dictionaries, in some federal and state criminal statutes, and elsewhere.”

“The finding that Ms. Carroll failed to prove that she was ‘raped’ within the meaning of the New York Penal Law does not mean that she failed to prove that Mr. Trump ‘raped’ her as many people commonly understand the word ‘rape,’” Kaplan wrote.

More

[hlthe2b]

6. NO! This needs to be fixedf. He was not tried in criminal court thus cannot be "convicted."

He was found LIABLE in CIVIL COURT. I get that you are not a lawyer, but it matters.

You can say that the judge found the ACT for which he was found LIABLE (adjudicated in civil court) would have met the definition of RAPE in other states, but the then current law in NY did not hold digital penetration as constituting rape but rather sexual assault.

He was not "convicted." He was adjudicated in civil court as liable for sexual assault which in many other states WOULD meet their legal definition of rape.

It matters.

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

9. "Judge in E. Jean Carroll Case: Yes, Donald Trump Is a Rapist " - Quote, Mother Jones

https://newrepublic.com/post/174448/judge-e-jean-carroll-case-yes-donald-trump-rapist

“ Judge in E. Jean Carroll Case: Yes, Donald Trump Is a Rapist ”

Judge in E. Jean Carroll Case: Yes, Donald Trump Is a Rapist

Judge in E. Jean Carroll Case: Yes, Donald Trump Is a Rapist

Judge in E. Jean Carroll Case: Yes, Donald Trump Is a Rapist

Judge in E. Jean Carroll Case: Yes, Donald Trump Is a Rapist

“RAPIST”

https://newrepublic.com/post/174448/judge-e-jean-carroll-case-yes-donald-trump-rapist

[hlthe2b]

18. You are being disingenous. I said the judge did NOT say he was a "CONVICTED" rapist

which would mean he had been indicted, tried, and found GUILTY IN CRIMINAL COURT, not CIVIL.

I don't disagree that it is rape. It would be in Colorado. But NY law at the time did not allow for digital penetration to be tried in criminal court as RAPE. So, he was adjudicated (as the judge acknowledged for the act that MOST states would construe and try as RAPE BUT could only be found liable for sexual assault in NY under NY law at the time.

[hlthe2b]

2. PLEASE FIX THIS He was NOT CONVICTED. It was civil court. See my previous post! FIX IT!

We don't do this here. Accuracy matters.

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

4. YES Most Americans view HE WAS LIABLE FOR RAPE IN CIVIL COURT !!

Last edited Mon Dec 16, 2024, 06:46 PM - Edit history (2)

You are mistaken as far as most Americans view it.

In most of America… “ being found liable for million$ in a Civil Case for XXX sexual assault is considered a conviction, in common language, although not criminally legally.

Although legal requirements, specific legal definitions of rape vary from state to state


Sure an attorney may argue that’s not legally the specific crime,

Yes, Trump was not “convicted” in the legal term of the US legal system.

But most of the American public view a civil case where jury finds against the defendant a de facto conviction by a jury, a jury finding Trump liable for millions.

[hlthe2b]

7. No. You can not be convicted of anything in CIVIL COURT. FIX IT!

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

10. ,

[hlthe2b]

12. ABC and you, for that matter would be defensible in saying "adjudicated rapist" given what the judge wrote.

But to say (write) "convicted" rapist is not true and could pose issues for this site's administrators if someone chose to make an issue of it. It is libelous BECAUSE it is not true, given he never faced criminal charges. Legal specificity MATTERS. You are new here but this site has successfully fought off RW legal challenges before. But to allow legally defined LIBELOUS comments to remain may well render them far less successful in a defense.

Stephanopoulos made a defensible claim of "adjudicated" rapist because of the above. ABC decided to curry favor and caved in a settlement they could write off as a contribution to his "Presidential library" efforts. But, had they said "convicted" rapist, they would have had zero case.

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

13. No.

As I told you previously…

Most all Americans see a person, any person, who is found liable for MILLIONS
in a case of a woman claiming and showing the jury that she was raped, and then jury finds
it indeed happened, in civil court to be liable, Most Americans see that as “guilty”,,

Even though you are correct, in civil court there is no “conviction”

Semantics. Period.

Guilty = LIABLE FOR MILLIONS

That’s how Americans view it.

I’m sorry you can’t see that stark reality how Americans see this.

You can argue all you want about specific legalities,
Convicted versus found liable civilly for millions.

[hlthe2b]

14. It is NOT semantics and could pose a legal problem for this website. You are new and maybe don't care...

but the rest of us DO.

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

17. Well I have already changed the header, where is the problem?

I already changed the original subject line,

I changed it to “Convicted Felon”

Trump IS INDEED “ A CONVICTED FELON”

[hlthe2b]

20. Only after my dozens of attempts to explain to you and your repeated arguments/refusal to do so.

Don't dare act as though you edited the header early on. You argued for at least a dozen times and refused to change it from the libelous "convicted rapist" as I beseeched you to do for the sake of the admins, the users, and website in general. I guess I am relieved you finally seemed to show you were not trying to cause problems intentionally but how damned disingenuous of you to suggest you "changed it, so what's the problem?" Bullshit.

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

15. FACT: Trump is convicted FELON, jury finds him a RAPIST in civil court. FED Judge made that clear. MotherJone Jan 2024

FACT: Trump is convicted FELON, jury finds him a liable RAPIST in civil court. FED Judge made that clear. MotherJone Jan 2024

LIABLE.

TRUMP IS FOUND LIABLE BECAUSE THE JURY, SAME AS THE JUDGE, FOUND IT CREDIBLE
THAT TRUMP IS A RAPIST.

THE JUDGE STATED “RAPE”

By your convoluted legal analysis being guilty is not the same as liable.

If Trump has been found LIABLE for damages, BY THE JURY,
Then explain how Trump is NOT a RAPIST.


BUT YES, Being convicted CRIMINALLY is different
I have never stated Trump has been convicted criminally

[hlthe2b]

16. And you can say THAT. But he was NOT convicted nor even indicted for rape. He was found LIABLE in civil court

of sexual assault which in many cases WOULD be legally equated to rape--even if no genital penetration occurred. The latter as I have repeatedly repeatedly told you is what the judge said.

That you don't seem to care that this could place the admins in some legal difficulty despite my pointing it out multiple times is quite curious to me. Surely you know that the RW would like nothing more than to cause problems for DU and its owners/administrators. Do you not care?

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

19. I don't get why you dwell on this,,, It was changed removed long ago...l

Don’t you agree most Americans view it as “guilty” when a person is found liable
for millions by a jury, a jury in civil court???

[hlthe2b]

21. I have told you a dozen times. YOu apparently don't care if you cause legal problems for this website

even after being repeatedly counseled as to why you can't do that.

Only after my dozens of attempts to explain to you and your repeated arguments/refusal to do so did you FINALLY edit the header to remove the potentially libelous statement.

Don't dare act as though you edited the header early on. You argued for at least a dozen times and refused to change it from the libelous "convicted rapist" as I beseeched you to do for the sake of the admins, the users, and website in general. I guess I am relieved you finally seemed to show you were not trying to cause problems intentionally but how damned disingenuous of you to suggest you "changed it, so what's the problem?" Bullshit.

[Kid Berwyn]

5. So why is ABC sending his lie-bury $15M?

If Stephanopoulos thinks Biden's too old, he should know the answer. And be ashamed.

[IrishBubbaLiberal]

8. ABC had FACTS on their side, but chose not to fight, just give in to Herr Trump

ABC News cowardly capitulated to Herr Trump’s
bullshit lawsuit, even when the rape by Trump was backed up by facts, facts 100% supported
by the jury’s decision against Trump for rape, and the Judge’s own words issued by the court in the rape case against Trump, the judge calling it “rape”!

This $15M was a complete corporate payoff to Trump by ABC.

Pathetic ABC.


Copied from another DU post….

“Mainstream media, US corporate media, is really only for the wealthy now…as all the talking heads are just as wealthy, so are more than happy to protect their own interests by pretending to be for the 'little guy'.”


….It's a damn tragedy to see ABC fall to this pathetic simping level. Pure cowardness. Peter Jennings would be rolling over in his grave.

[Kid Berwyn]

11. ABCNNBCBSFixedNoiseNutworks vs. what the Founders saw.

Democracy depends on truth.

The rightwing bias of media ownership is loathsome, particularly in broadcasting. Newspapers, for all their faults, are the best way I know for a community to share what citizens must know. The nation's founders understood this. That's why the PRESS is the only business mentioned by name in the US Constitution.

First Amendment:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

If we don't know what's what or who's who we won't know why it's going on. And by why I mean oversight, responsibility and accountability for all the mass murder, wars without end, global and domestic fascism, and treason is known by We the People -- who before MAGA, were considered the most important part of the USofA.