Does it mean a change of regimes from Islamic hard-liners to a more modern democracy that is better aligned with the majority of Iranian people? No way that is happening.

Does it mean destruction of nuclear capability and capture of any enriched stocks? NO way that is happening.

Does it mean getting Epstein off the front pages and allowing Netanyahu to maintain a grip on power? Yes.

Does it mean delivering on Putin's desire to fracture NATO? Yes.

Does it mean increasing the military-industrial-complex and shutting down more social programs. Yes.

Trump has not states any coherent objective or rationale for this war, so how can anybody say we "won" anything?

Wounded Bear

(64,344 posts)

4. Been a problem since WWII...

Reply to Bluetus (Reply #3)

Fri Apr 3, 2026, 04:29 PM

3 hrs ago

Defining what "victory" means has been tough to do ever since. Most of the fights we've gotten into since then the term "victory" doesn't even apply. Like the old movie (Wargame IIRC) says. Only way to win is not to play.

Bluetus

(2,819 posts)

6. The major media can't even ask the question. How hard is that?

Reply to Wounded Bear (Reply #4)

Fri Apr 3, 2026, 07:23 PM

57 min ago

Why did we enter Vietnam? "Communism ... (babble babble) ... Dominoes ... (babble babble) ..." etc.

Why did attack Iran? I have heard only two things that were even halfway coherent: 1) regime change, and 2) they were about to blow up the world with nukes.

Trump keeps saying they must make a deal or else we'll commit more war crimes. So what deal do we want, either for regime change or nukes?

We have done nothing that shows any intention of making Iranian lives any better. Not one word from Trump or Hegseth about that, so I think we can ignore the regime change thing.

So are we asking for a deal on nukes? We had a deal that was working and Trump tore that up. Is he negotiating a new nuke deal? It sounds more like he just wants to steal Iran's oil. It sounds like the "deal" is, give me half your oil and we’ll stop bombing you.

Seriously, why doesn't the media ask the most obvious questions?

Brenda

(2,063 posts)

5. Good post. And Macron said it well yesterday, too:

Reply to Bluetus (Reply #3)

Fri Apr 3, 2026, 04:33 PM

3 hrs ago

Emmanuel Macron has sharply criticised Donald Trump’s inconsistent and often contradictory pronouncements on the Iran war and Nato, saying if “you want to be serious” it was better not to come out with something different every day.

“There is too much talk … and it’s all over the place,” the French president said on Thursday during a state visit to South Korea. “We all need stability, calm, a return to peace – this isn’t a show!”

Macron added: “You have to be serious. When you want to be serious, you don’t go around saying the opposite every day of what you just said the day before. And perhaps you shouldn’t talk every day.”

In other words SHUT THE FUCK UP.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/apr/02/you-have-to-be-serious-macron-criticises-trumps-mixed-messages-about-nato-and-iran

RockRaven

(19,399 posts)

2. Ya think!?

Reply to SamuelTheThird (Original post)

Fri Apr 3, 2026, 03:58 PM

4 hrs ago

A war waged by Kegsbreath and The Dotard, at the behest of Netanyahu, Kushner, and Mr Bone Saw... Who could have seen failure coming?

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