Self delete

[Tribetime]

Last edited Sat Nov 30, 2024, 11:37 AM - Edit history (1)

[Tanuki]

1. You were told, with evidence, in your other post that borax is toxic

and should not be ingested!
Why are you persisting in this? You are being extremely irresponsible!

https://www.poison.org/articles/can-borax-treat-inflammation#:~:text=Is%20borax%20toxic%3F,green%20color%20after%j20eating%20borax.

...."Borax is a mineral-based compound that contains boron. It is commonly used as an industrial chemical, food preservative, and household cleaning product. Borax is not intended for human consumption, and may cause toxic effects when swallowed, inhaled, or applied to the skin. There is minimal evidence supporting the use of borax as an anti-inflammatory agent in humans.
.....
Borax and other boron-containing compounds can be poisonous when eaten, inhaled, or applied to the skin. Short-term consumption of borax can result in stomach irritation, vomiting, and diarrhea. Vomit and stool may turn a blue-green color after eating borax. Skin redness, rashes, and peeling skin can also occur in people who eat borax. People who eat borax for weeks or longer may develop anemia and seizures. When borax comes into contact with human skin, it can cause skin rashes, itching, and allergic reactions in susceptible individuals. "

[exmodee]

3. Boron is an ingredient in Osteo-Biflex

which is an arthritis supplement sold everywhere. Not sure why you insist on equating it with borax.

[Tanuki]

5. I'm not the one equating them.

https://democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1018&pid=2102341

[Emile]

15. Have you googled Boron for arthritis?

[Bernardo de La Paz]

2. Borax is not Boron even tho it contains Boron. Just like table salt is not Chlorine even tho it contains Chlorine. .

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1018&pid=2102336

[ProfessorGAC]

17. Borax Is...

...Sodium Tetraborate Decahydrate.
As you said, it contains boron, but less than 10% of the mass is actually boron.
Plus, even adjusting for the boron content, elemental boron is around 2.5 times more toxic.
Nothing for the inexperienced to play around with.

[Skittles]

4. I don't take anything my doc doesn't recommend

no INDEED

[Tribetime]

7. I was asking if you took it sorry Skittles I guess I should delete

Nobody has tried it....I'm trying to not have back surgery can't afford to miss work again I'm too old and can't afford to retire ever...I feel l I ke hell

[Skittles]

9. I do feel for you

I had back pain once for about a week and all I could think of was those folk who suffer from chronic back pain, I COMMISERATE

[Tribetime]

11. Ty Skittles

[happybird]

10. I know this might sound flippant but

have you tried physical therapy and/or recommended stretches everyday?

I thought it was bs when my back was bad, and I currently have a nerve issue plus arthritis in my hip... the stretching really does make a huge difference. I'm even thinking of taking a yoga class now.

Stretching seems like such a small thing that it couldn't possibly help alleviate big, constant pain but depending on your issue it could help, a lot.

Sending good thoughts your way.

[wnylib]

12. Try blueberries. They are a tasty anti inflammatory.

I buy them fresh, rinse them thoroughly, pat them dry with paper towels, and then freeze them in zip lock bags. They work for me. Keeps the osteoarthritis away.

Add a handful to breakfast cereal every day. Or, make blueberry muffins with them. Or heat them in a saucepan with a little sugar and water and pour the resulting juice and berries over pancakes or waffles instead of syrup. The longer you heat them that way, the thicker the juice gets.

Here's a list of foods that fight inflammation. Just scroll past the intro info to see the list.

https://www.gwhospital.com/about/blog/these-10-foods-help-fight-inflammation#:~:text=Berries%3A%20Strawberries%2C%20blueberries%2C%20raspberries,anthocyanins%20that%20help%20reduce%20inflammation.

Pineapple and its juice are also good for inflammation and for healing body tissue. Sweet enough to buy it packed in its own juice, no sugar added. Put it on cottage cheese or eat pineapple yogurt. Pineapple as a topping on ice cream or frozen yogurt.

[hlthe2b]

14. Yes. I can attest to the value of an anti-inflammatory diet--not only for arthritis but in general

Because so many are "addicted" to highly processed foods, it takes some effort, but it is worth it. For those who follow it, they can immediately see why it makes the difference because a severe flare of symptoms will follow even one episode of sugary treats and simple carbs the day before.

To those recommending therapeutic stretching and yoga, that too is highly effective over the long term.

There are some safer supplements, especially for those who can't take NSAIDs. Among those SAM-e (S-adenosyl-L-methionine) which is naturally occurring in the body. Its benefits as a supplement include anti-inflammatory impacts among others and is accompanied by supportive studies. It is generally safe to supplement except for those on anti-depressants or other similar classes of drugs ( https://www.mayoclinic.org/drugs-supplements-same/art-20364924 )

[Silent Type]

6. NIH says Boron could be beneficial for SOME people. Have no idea otherwise, here's link.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4712861/

[Tribetime]

8. Thank you so much

[sl8]

24. NIH or Lara Pizzorno?

Don't attach any particular credibility to a study just because it's listed in the NLM database.

This disclaimer relates to PubMed, PubMed Central (PMC), and Bookshelf. These three resources are scientific literature databases offered to the public by the U.S. National Library of Medicine (NLM). NLM is not a publisher, but rather collects, indexes, and archives scientific literature published by other organizations. The presence of any article, book, or document in these databases does not imply an endorsement of, or concurrence with, the contents by NLM, the National Institutes of Health (NIH), or the U.S. Federal Government.

Here's what the NIH says about boron:
https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Boron-HealthProfessional/

[iamateacher]

13. Had a bad back for 35 years

Manage it with chiropractic care (way cheaper and more effective than back surgery), ice (not heat), swimming,
or physical therapy works also.

[Tribetime]

18. I've been through all that starting in nineteen ninety two

And I had the chiropractor doing the electronic vacuum puncture which helped until it didn't and I couldn't walk without paying shooting up both my legs. So I had no choice but to have surgery cause I couldn't walk.This was after years of rehabilitation.
Massage therapy everything

[ProfessorGAC]

16. A Few Things

First, the claims are based on boron compounds, not boron.
While the toxicity if boron is well-understood, the LD50 of borax (Sodium tetraborate decahydrate) is quite high, at around 6g per kg of body weight.
Boron, however, has an LD50 of around 2g for total body weight of the typical adult.
So, you need to grasp the difference between boron & a molecule that is less than 10% boron by mass.
Second, it's doubtful anybody is taking boron for arthritis as it would cost around $260/ounce for 99.9% boron metal.
Finally, I'm not sure it's wise to ask for medical advice from strangers on the internet.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

19. Good points, but better is noting that long before LD50 there are very injurious effects. . . . nt

[ProfessorGAC]

20. No Doubt

Bur, generally speaking, low dose exposure effects are correlated to IDLH levels. Might not be 1:1, but LD50 & LD10 are typically good indicators as to the overall toxicity.
I was usually very attuned to these things because I worked with a lot of dangerous compounds which, in my case, were non-dangerous after the reaction. And, working in sites using them at industrial scale, I routinely assessed my risk.

[Tribetime]

22. Man you are way above my pay grade

I haven't a clue

[ProfessorGAC]

23. I Spent 43 Years...

...working as a R&D chemist or as a optimization guru at industrial scale.
I not only have the educational background but loads of experience knowing how to stay safe around bad actors.
It's now habit. And of course, habits are tough to break.

[Clouds Passing]

21. I did for about a year. Didn't work for me. Others swear by it.

[Niagara]

25. I don't know anything about "Boron".

I do know something about arthritis, fibromyalgia and sacroiliac joint issues because I have a involuntary relationship with all 3.


I don't know your eating habits, your physical activity levels or if you have physical limitations.


I'm fairly young and I've had to adjust my eating habits or "diet" as I call it. I equate diet as a normal everyday eating habits if that makes any sense. I don't equate diet with being on a diet. This is why a colossal amount of DU Lounge food threads get on my nerves and annoy me and are in my auto-trash, because I can't eat the same way other's do.


Some ways of eating that trigger arthritis inflammations are: gluten, high salt, sugar, processed food, fried food, and refined carbs.


I walk frequently... I call it "hitting the pavement" because it's not a strolling and leisurely walk. If I don't walk I'm performing squats or yoga. I hadn't done squats in awhile and I just got back into it. I paid dearly for a few days because I got back into them too quickly. Now, I'm feeling great.


I also take a magnesium supplement. I don't do this frequently because I'm generally fasting (not eating for long periods of time). I don't take supplements during fasting.


Good luck, Tribetime.

[Mike 03]

26. I do take Boron, not necessarily for arthritis, although

I hope maybe to prevent it. I take Boron for general bone health and proper hormone production, to complement the extra magnesium, vitamin K and vitamin D I take.