Is feminism only as strong as the men who support it?

[theHandpuppet]

Sometimes you find the most interesting articles by sheer accident. I was researching the money trail of PR and the world's coal markets (yes, really) when I spotted a link to this article from the Canberra Times (Australia). I'd be most interested in your opinions. I'm still mulling over some of the questions posed in the article.

Is feminism only as strong as the men who support it?
May 28, 2014
Elizabeth Farrelly
Sydney Morning Herald columnist, author, architecture critic and essayist

(short excerpt)
It made me rethink women and power, again. For it’s not just about who wields power, but also how we frame it. What kind of power it is.

Even feminism, striving for power-balance, generally couches power in conventional politico-corporate terms. But perhaps that’s wrong. Women’s power is different in kind, as well as gender; earthier, broader, more intuitive. Properly harnessed, it could change far more than the name-cards at table. It could upend the entire smorgasbord.

This of course is what men fear. Educated, freed, women are dangerous. Fear begets anger. Anger begets violence.

''You rejected me and that’s a crime that can never be forgiven,'' pouted pretty-boy Elliot Rodger, shooting a selfie-vid in his BMW before killing six people. ''If I can’t have you, girls, I will destroy you.''

Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment/is-feminism-only-as-strong-as-the-men-who-support-it-20140528-zrqo0.html#ixzz33aS1Cglb

[seabeyond]

1. no. now i will read the article. i was answering the title though.

i say no cause.... our feminism is our real world what ever that is. our experience and how those experiences shapes thoughts and ideas. ergo, others experiences.

men can be helpful or not. they can be part of the problem. but, no. i do not think in any way are we dependent on men, for success.

and that is not an insult to men. but, it may be an example of the issue with men in feminism. and the continued need to coddle and not being able to honestly assess and conclude.

interesting what the title alone brings up. i hope we talk about just the title.

now. i will read. thanks.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

2. like sea, I have only read the title and excerpt you posted and I take away a different reply

A chain is only as strong as its weakest link. That should mean that Our Chain is only as strong as Our Weakest Link be it any Man or Woman that is in our Chain.

It behooves us to educate our least knowledgeable in order to strengthen Our Chain.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

3. ''What'', Katz asks, ''is going on with men?''

Indeed, what is their problem?

Fear.

They are afraid of the Change that Has to Come.

[JustAnotherGen]

4. Read the article

I think - no.

I think Feminism is only as strong as our ability to turn our natural born right to equality into different pieces of legislation/law that can change how we experience the world.

[ismnotwasm]

6. No

Last edited Tue Jun 3, 2014, 01:55 PM - Edit history (1)

Feminism is only as strong as the women who shed blood, and swear and tears and lives to fight patriartical systems. Men, decent men, follow because they recognize inherent injustice in such systems.

Language is very powerful, it carries cultural freight; words fall in and out of fashion, some people re able to carry words so far it transcends original meaning--for a time. Men are in power all over the world, we recognize this, we understand it. Women have been trained from birth to fear men, to not speak up, to not fight. We do anyway. And when a woman stands on the backs of those who went before her, to provide her with actual choices, and claims 'I'm not a feminist' they simply don't understand history, or don't care.

That being said, we seem to be out of Dworkins, Feminism has fractured, but I don't see that as bad. Women of color are speaking up. Women of religion are speaking up. Women in the most unlikely countries are speaking up. Women in the most unlikely professions are speaking up. It's not all called feminism but feminisn laid the groundwork

We are sick of the bullshit.

In the West, the era of the straight white male is almost over, which is why there is such ugly pushback. Elsewhere, strongly ingrained cultural values and norms are being challenged, also with very ugly pushback.

Excellent article BTW

[MadrasT]

7. I think "no".

We are not going to sit around continuing to defer to men. Too many women are fed up and angry. Playing by their rules doesn't work.

The whole game is changing... men will have to adjust because women are just not inclined to play their rigged game by their stupid rules anymore.

Rise up.

[seabeyond]

9. not going to sit around continuing to defer to men.

Playing by their rules doesn't work.

Rise up.

DA woman

[theHandpuppet]

13. Amen to that!

If we wait for the very last man and woman to join us in the lifeboat, we'll simply all end up drowning.

[geek tragedy]

8. if feminism were dependent upon men, it would have never come into existence nt

[theHandpuppet]

11. And if we are waiting for men to tell us when and where and how much...

... we'll be waiting another few thousand years. I think we've gotten beyond the point of needing a permission slip.

[CTyankee]

10. No. It is just too easy for even men who are feminist leaning to take a break from advocacy about

our causes (which benefit him as well!). We have to make it uncomfortable for them not to be. It is up to us, really. I know I'm firing up my feminist husband now...we keep the dialogue going in our household...it's good to keep the issues on the front burner at all times!

[theHandpuppet]

12. Absolutely

Our advocacy CANNOT be the cause to be championed only when everything else on the priority list is dealt with. If that were the case, there would always be "a something else" that's deemed more important.

[CTyankee]

14. I always remind my husband of his daughter, a rabbi in a reformed synagogue in AZ...

he knows what the struggles were, even in reformed judaism, and what she had to put up with...

[F4lconF16]

15. As a man, I would say definitely not.

From what I've learned and experienced, the core strength of feminism comes from the women who have suffered and fought for their rights. The most passionate women I have met said that their will and their strength to keep pushing for equality despite what they have to deal with on a daily basis comes from having been oppressed and needing to make things better.

While I can help the cause, while I can speak out and stand up for the rights of women around me, feminism will never depend on my help and the help of other men. It's only here because of the women who stood up in the first place and said, "This isn't right." It will continue to have success in the future because of women like them, though broad support of men will certainly accelerate progress.

The other thing that ran through my mind when I read the title (and I think the author somewhat addresses this) is that the idea that feminism is dependent on men is just stupid. Women should not and do not need the support of men in order to succeed.

[Violet_Crumble]

16. That article's from my local paper, and my answer is no...

Right now we've got an ultra-conservative government, led by a man who's proven time and time again he is a misogynist. Yet feminism has gotten more support from the population than before, even though the govt has dismantled programs and agencies that assist women.

That wink in the photo at the start of the artlcle? That's one of the ugliest winks I've ever seen. That was in response to a woman in her 60's calling in to a radio show he was on telling him that because of the govts cuts to Medicare and the aged pension, she was working on a sex line to try to make ends meet.

I don't know if any of you watch John Oliver, coz I'd never heard of him till my fellow Aussie DUer Matilda posted this segment about our horrible prime minister...

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1y1ez7_tony-abbott-last-week-tonight_news

[nomorenomore08]

17. Men need feminism more than feminism needs men. That's what I, as a man, have come to believe.

Of course it is and should be a movement primarily by and for women - the "fem-" prefix ain't for nothin' - but that doesn't mean men aren't also benefited via being able to increasingly free themselves from outdated "macho" gender roles. And LOL at the stupid fucks claiming feminists are prudish or "sex-negative" - no one hates sex, or the human body, more than good-old-fashioned patriarchal Puritans.