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6chars

(3,967 posts)
23. i don't think you would consider anything proof
Thu Jul 21, 2016, 10:05 PM
Jul 2016

so with these surveys, you try to get a lot of participants because you really can't control with stratified sampling or similar techniques. 36,000 is a good number. you have questions relating to political viewpoint, like "should the tax code be more progressive", "is defense funding too high or too low or just right", "should corporations be more or less regulated", "should ... (questions relating to approval of German constitution" and then mixed in questions relating to attitudes toward people "do you think Jews have too much influence" "are Jews overly interested in money" and you have questions about other things too. So, no obvious pattern in the questions. You then sort people into categories for purposes of the study as moderate, moderate left, right, extreme left, etc based on their answers on the first set and you define "holding anti-semitic views" as having the associated answers to the questions about Jews. With this survey, you can't say x% of Germans have these views because maybe - this is the problem with online - the people answering tended to be internet people who are maybe more extremist or more left or whatever. You can say - as the authors did 34% of people who answered and were assigned to category of radical left also gave responses we defined as representing anti-semitic views. Credible study.

Maybe you don't like that they used "Jews have too much influence" and "Jews are overly interested in money" as their definition of holding anti-semitic views. Then you disapprove of the wording of the results as representing anti-semitism, even though the results themselves are valid. Do you think those two questions indicate anti-semitic views?

Maybe you don't like the way responses they used to categorize respondentws as radical leftist.

They don't do studies like "What is your name?" Hans. "What are your politics" "I am a radical leftist" "are you anti-semitic" "Yes"

This is a quite large scale study by academic standards. If you need more proof, it is not possible to produce it.

This isn't an accusation - it is reporting the results of a study. The study IS the exact evidence for what is being reported. The German leftists aren't being punished for holding anti-semitic views. They don't themselves classify these views as anti-semitic, much as some people don't classify support for Hamas terrorism (not in this study) as anti-semitic. There is no real consequence here. The study just tells us - reliably! - that a substantial proportion of people who hold the views that the authors name as radical leftist also hold views that the authors (and common sense?) classify as anti-semitic. And that the proportion is higher among radical leftists than mere extreme leftists. And, I believe, higher among extreme leftists than among the general population completing the survey.

If one does not trust social science, but only trust one's gut, one will develop ideas that cannot be challenged and one may find oneself holding some strong but wrong viewpoints.

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Has anyone ever found the DNA code for scapegoating? gordianot Jul 2016 #1
Racism is raising its ugly head yet again. PatrickforO Jul 2016 #2
Numbers would be higher with truth serum 6chars Jul 2016 #3
It's an online survey and the methodology seems a bit shoddy, so I'm not really sure if the results Little Tich Jul 2016 #4
it would be nice to know if there are any anti-Semites among the German left 6chars Jul 2016 #5
That poster believes it's not antisemitic to support Hamas' murdering of Jews. shira Jul 2016 #6
that's what some on the German left believe... 6chars Jul 2016 #7
The problem is that there's no serious survey that can reveal German leftist attitudes towards Jews. Little Tich Jul 2016 #8
If you cannot be persuaded that support for Hamas murdering Jews is anti-semitic.... shira Jul 2016 #9
So a shoddy survey can be made unshoddy by your use of the Hamas dogwhistle? Little Tich Jul 2016 #10
People who support Hamas murdering innocent random Jews are antisemites. shira Jul 2016 #11
It's as if we're posting in different threads. n/t Little Tich Jul 2016 #12
Simple question for you proving my point. Is it antisemitic.... shira Jul 2016 #13
We seem to differ on what we believe is important for a survey. Little Tich Jul 2016 #15
What do you know about reliability of surveys? shira Jul 2016 #17
There's currently no serious survey about German leftist attitudes towards Jews that I know of. Little Tich Jul 2016 #19
many surveys do not have control groups 6chars Jul 2016 #21
I don't like accusing German leftists of being anti-Semitic without proof, is all. Little Tich Jul 2016 #22
i don't think you would consider anything proof 6chars Jul 2016 #23
If that survey asked Leftist Germans whether they support "resistance to occupation"....... shira Jul 2016 #14
This message was self-deleted by its author 6chars Jul 2016 #16
Tich doesn't believe the experts on the definition of antisemitism... shira Jul 2016 #18
There's no indication of how the results of the survey came about. Little Tich Jul 2016 #20
Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Israel/Palestine»German left-wing radicals...»Reply #23